Curse

BlackSephir · Jun 03, 2011, 06:17 PM // 18:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

FA would be greatly invigorated if people were actually banned for leeching. I've said this before and I'll repeat it until it's enforced.

You'd think that a simple check if a player has not moved from his spot for x seconds would be better than relying on people's intelligence and trusting they will actually report leechers.
ANet doesn't think so apparently.

Horus Moonlight · Jun 03, 2011, 07:39 PM // 19:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

You'd think that a simple check if a player has not moved from his spot for x seconds would be better than relying on people's intelligence and trusting they will actually report leechers.
ANet doesn't think so apparently.

ANet has already implemented this.

BlackSephir · Jun 03, 2011, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Horus Moonlight

ANet has already implemented this.

Then why do I see the same characters leeching?

Horus Moonlight · Jun 03, 2011, 08:01 PM // 20:01

Because dishonor isn't permanent.

MithranArkanere · Jun 03, 2011, 08:16 PM // 20:16

I strongly think this mode needs to have positions reversed randomly, so instead having some always attacking and some always defending, what you'll willbe random.

That or having both sides mirrored, having both attacking and defending, like in the Snow Battle of the Gods.

makosi · Jun 03, 2011, 08:21 PM // 20:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

Then why do I see the same characters leeching?

By being idle for extended periods you will accrue dishonor points but you won't have your faction deducted unless 50% of the team reports you for leeching. People are often too reluctant/retarded to use the report feature.

This means that you can go to bed/work/school with GW on and an auto clicker to enter FA. You will get timed out for dishonor but your faction cap is likely to be full when you return.

Someone at anet will have to get a finger out and wave the ban stick (or at the very least, threaten the ban stick).

toek_boer · Jun 05, 2011, 10:25 AM // 10:25

Good day to all,

Ive enjoyed Fort Aspenwood for a long time. I used to play Luxon, it was always a bit more of a challange to me. I think most of us agree that Kurzick is slightly favoured. This is proven by the numbers of people joining the sides, Kurzick has always been busier.

I think thats because the goals of the game are not clear to everybody. Most people just seem to attack whatever they see, the thing its, it works on Kurzick side but it doesnt work on Luxon side. This is why people keep coming back to Kurzick, but not really to Luxon. Ive always thought this was more of challange so thats why I played Luxon.

The thing I dont get is, why did they buff Kurzick, faction-wise that is. Its totally uncalled for. This makes a lot of players who know what to do in this map, shift to Kurzick. Of course this results in mass-monking on the Kurzick side. Easy games.

So, whats left? Kurzick had more players, even more players shift to Kurzick...
The Kurzick waits increase and FA slowly dies?

What needs to be done imo is the following:
1) Restore the balance faction-wise. I know what ANet may have been thinking, if Luxons win, they win within a smaller timeframe, so more faction per minute. But, at this moment, fact is that Luxon side is harder, so, if something is harder, more faction may be awarded for a win.
2) Add a FA-Mission GUI. Maybe something like a textbox with objectives and checkboxes to direct players in the right direction, especially for the luxons. Im sure a lot of people use the minimap to see these things, but a lot do not.
3) Deal with bugs, ANet cannot or simply will not fix them, nothing you can do about it. FA was doable before this Kurzick faction-wise buff. I would also like to see them fixed, but if it was possible, why hasnt it been done yet?

Hope somebody reads this.

PS. Im against randomizing the sides. I love the fact that you have to pick a build which is defensive, runner, offensive, supportive, etc. Putting both sides together only encourages meta and cookie-cutter builds.

makosi · Jun 05, 2011, 10:59 AM // 10:59

@toes_boer, I agree with almost all of your post.

Quote:

Deal with bugs, ANet cannot or simply will not fix them, nothing you can do about it.

This is a too big a problem for the Luxon side. The reason the turtles' attacks were modified and buffed so many times was to try to offset the Kurzick advantage and bring each side in to alignment. As it stands now (actually, for several years), the turtles are becoming stuck on the spot and will not progress.

I whine about this a lot and get the same old answer, "you don't need turtles to win." I know this - Gunther just has to die to win - but the disadvantage experienced by the Luxon side is so great when one or more turtles are out of play. And, of course, broken turtles don't die and therefore don't respawn.

To "deal with bugs" isn't the right attitude. Fixing bugs of this magnitude is what needs to be done. Anet are still supporting the format by having Zaishen Combat days and Competitive Mission weekend events yet they bury their head in the sand with turtles.

Urcscumug · Jun 05, 2011, 12:13 PM // 12:13

To me that says that the turtle issue is too complicated to solve. It probably has something to do with AI and the FA map. Neither of which can be easily changed by the live team.

makosi · Jun 05, 2011, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urcscumug

To me that says that the turtle issue is too complicated to solve. It probably has something to do with AI and the FA map. Neither of which can be easily changed by the live team.

I'm inclined towards the idea that the turtle becomes stuck because the Luxon Warriors are blocking the way. The Luxon Warriors are programmed to encircle their turtle which means that when the mob goes out to fight then returns, the might be blocking it's path.

The Luxon Warriors follow the turtle, which cannot move if the warriors have collision.

ShaJiexi · Jun 05, 2011, 04:27 PM // 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

I'm inclined towards the idea that the turtle becomes stuck because the Luxon Warriors are blocking the way. The Luxon Warriors are programmed to encircle their turtle which means that when the mob goes out to fight then returns, the might be blocking it's path.

The Luxon Warriors follow the turtle, which cannot move if the warriors have collision.

If it were that simple, they could simply remove warrior/turtle collision. Solved.

It must be an AI issue. Though it would be nice if someone could SS a stuck turtle with no warrior entourage, just to make sure ^_^

makosi · Jun 05, 2011, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShaJiexi

If it were that simple, they could simply remove warrior/turtle collision. Solved.

It must be an AI issue. Though it would be nice if someone could SS a stuck turtle with no warrior entourage, just to make sure ^_^

Not that my anecdotal evidence would carry much weight in a supreme court, but I've never seen a lone turtle stalled.

toek_boer · Jun 05, 2011, 05:44 PM // 17:44

If it really was simple to solve, then you would expect it to be solved already right? (Right?)

I've never seen a stuck turtle without warriors.

Assuming the warriors ARE the cause, how about a skill like Carrier Defense, only it works on Allies? This should not be hard to implement, no changes to the map or AI (maybe minor). Most of it is duplicating a skill and changing a few mods of that skill.

melissa b · Jun 05, 2011, 07:42 PM // 19:42

What about an account based rotate system?...regardless on what side your on you play 3 times as a kurzick and then 3 times as a luxon and so on. There could be an icon to indicate what you will play as next.

Coraline Jones · Jun 05, 2011, 07:45 PM // 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackSephir

You'd think that a simple check if a player has not moved from his spot for x seconds would be better than relying on people's intelligence and trusting they will actually report leechers.
ANet doesn't think so apparently.

ANet does have this in place and it doesn't work. I'll put it this way: I used to be a healing monk in JQ that defended the closest shrine to the base. When you're playing a healing monk character on JQ, then you're most effective if you don't move from your spot because there's always going to be a RoJ monk or necro bomber that will show up as soon as you leave.

Despite that I was clearly playing and using spells to counter bombers and such in every game, I would get Dishonor Points and get temp banned despite that nobody had issued a single report against me while I was playing. After a time, I realized that the game didn't want me to play defensive at all, and I switched to standard gimmick builds.

The system that you described has done literally nothing to help the situation. Sure, leeching is almost never done anymore. Now it's full-blown botting where you have an AI-controlled player running around like an idiot and clicking the buttons so it looks like they are playing. Whenever ANet does any kind of automated system to get rid of exploiters, then all this does is slow them down for two weeks at most. The botters have far more resources than all of ANet, and they quickly figure out how to counter any preventive measure and keep on doing it.

ShaJiexi · Jun 06, 2011, 03:42 AM // 03:42

Turtles got stuck in 4/5 matches played as Luxon today. Each time had warriors right in front of them. Guessing it is a blocking issue.

On a side note, killed Gunther while the weapon was at 26%. Kurzick side had 3 monks, at least two of which were healers. I felt kinda sorry for them :\

Kanyatta · Jun 06, 2011, 05:14 AM // 05:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urcscumug

To me that says that the turtle issue is too complicated to solve..

I feel that the turtle issue is way too overblown. I've FA'd at least 3 separate occasions every week for the past 2 months, and 100% of the time on the Luxon side. I've seen a turtle get stuck once, over the course of at least 50 matches played, and that's the lowest estimate possible that I can give. And ever since Factions came out, I've always preferred to FA over AB, and I had never even heard of turtle sticking until recently.

Maybe I'm just that lucky to have less than a 2% turtle block rate, but I've just rolled a DwG Rit and I've won at least 80% of the games I've played on the Luxon side. It's so easy to just spike out the Green Gate guards and then spike out each gatekeeper while a monk isn't paying attention. And you only have to kill one Gatekeeper each respawn, since there's no Death Penalty, and there's definitely enough power in one Ritualist to put out enough damage to kill any single gatekeeper within 3 seconds (Spirit Rift, Channeled Strike, DwG, along with Ancestor's Rage + 2nd DwG, if necessary). The only time I ever really lose is when there's a bond monk and no one with mass enchant removal on the Luxon side.

Overall, the map is sided more heavily towards the Kurzick side, since they're playing defense and have all the NPC advantages, but whenever you stick 8 random PvE-ers together, there's not going to be much coordination leading to good play. Same for the Luxon side. That's why everyone just plays builds where they can stay alive solo for as long as possible, and that's the downfall of FA. Unless you allow groups a certain period of time to discuss strat or share builds, FA is always going to be like it is right now, and that's what makes it different from any other form of "PvP" (using that term lightly).

So, I dunno, to me the only solution to change FA is if syncing is encouraged, or something like that. I feel like FA is suiting its purpose exactly as it was intended right now. 8 randoms grouping together and fighting NPC's and another team of randoms...

Skyy High · Jun 06, 2011, 02:28 PM // 14:28

Imperial faction made FA so much more replayable.

SebaZ · Jun 06, 2011, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by makosi

They'll have to encourage Luxon playing in FA. Fixing ye olde turtle stalling bug would be a good start I think.

how about fixing the fact that you can pull the main Kurzick npcs way out of the green gate?

Hobbs · Jun 06, 2011, 06:04 PM // 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyy High

Imperial faction made FA so much more replayable.

That's true. I used to play it a huge amount as it was, for me, the most enjoyable way of farming Luxon faction and it gave a healthy amount of ZKeys too. I stopped playing it after I maxed Luxon but i've gone back and start playing it again.